british gay muslims get married

[Long Duck Dong]

honestly the LGBT think they have it hard ????

british muslim gays are married (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12486003)

a islamic lesbian couple have wed using a traditional islamic marriage ceremony that is traditionally reserved for straight muslims.... and they were married by a muslim lesbian.....

its a hard road they face, as the islam faith can be anti LGBT and strict about it and being gay, means that they are not treated as equals in british society.... but bigotry and biased amongst the gay community as well...... ???

its a sad day when a community that seeks equal rights, acceptance and tolerance, houses some very judgemental assholes..... and it can make one wonder, just who are the real bigots in society.....

* It is not just within the Muslim community that gay Muslim couples such as Sarah and Asra have encountered hostility.

"I feel there's Islamaphobia within the gay community. It's something that really worries me," says Sarah.

Asra recalls a particularly unsavoury incident.

"There was an occasion at gay pride once where one of the marchers turned around and quite crudely said 'we didn't know pride was allowing suicide bombers on the march' - it was really shocking to hear it from a fellow gay marcher." *

sighs.... how can people fight for rights for all, if they can not be supportive of their own community......????

best of wishes and luck to the couple... they are gonna need it

[elian]

Prejudice knows no boundaries LDD - the only way to fight it is with compassion and personal experience.

I know an older friend who is very upset that gay people do not have equal rights on one hand but still believes that females have too much freedom. I tried pointing out that just as some people are BORN with predisposition to be gay, some people are also BORN female but I'm not sure it has sunk in.

It's always much easier to close a door and feel secure in the way you think the world works than to leave it open and be vulnerable to having the way you view the world changed.

The couple in the story are very courageous. As far as the gay pride marchers - listen to the media and we are presented with some very horrific and scary stories on a daily basis. You can either repeat the canned stories (and hence canned ideas) or learn to think for yourself. I stubbornly cling to my belief that there is a difference in moderate vs. fundamentalist thought. After all, if we are not overseas fighting for moderate people to have some sort of voice, why are we even there at all?

I am not excusing fundamentalist dogma and the result of that, but it important for people to realize that the moderate viewpoint seldom sells news copy either. I recently participated in a Freedom to Marry Rally on Valentine's Day - in what you might normally think of as a relatively conservative area given what it says on paper about us. I was pleasantly surprised by the number of honks we got from passing traffic in support of the cause. It got me to thinking that maybe the moderate viewpoint just doesn't get a lot of air time lately.

[darkeyes]

If it is from the heart and spoken in the manner of their belief then they are truly married.. it is a pity that the laws of the constituent nations of the United Kingdom will not recognise it as such.. they will be considered cohabitees even partners and will have certain rights as such, but not in law a married couple for the whole gambit that married couples or those in civil unions do.. but to them what they feel and believe is what is important and for them, and people like them it is essential that we continue to strive to gain equal rights for all under the law in the eyes of all in society.. and to always press and persuade the religious institutions who call themselves compassionate and that all men and women are equal under God and that God, should he/she/it exist, doesnt give a bugger about the gender or sexuality of any couple who are in love and wish to marry in accord with their beliefs..

Once in my country a simple declaration by two people before their God unwitnessed or witnessed being immaterial, was all that was required for a couple to be recognised as married by the world at large.. the Roman Catholic church when it replaced the old Celtic church soon put a stop to that.. maybe it is time to go back to those ancient days when we decide whether we are in a union and not church or state.. and for that union to be recognised for what it is.. a marriage of two people...

So I agree with Duckie.. good luck to them.. they will need it, but I sense they are not alone in the world and without support..

[DuckiesDarling]

If it is from the heart and spoken in the manner of their belief then they are truly married.. it is a pity that the laws of the constituent nations of the United Kingdom will not recognise it as such.. they will be considered cohabitees even partners and will have certain rights as such, but not in law a married couple for the whole gambit that married couples or those in civil unions do.. but to them what they feel and believe is what is important and for them, and people like them it is essential that we continue to strive to gain equal rights for all under the law in the eyes of all in society.. and to always press and persuade the religious institutions who call themselves compassionate and that all men and women are equal under God and that God, should he/she/it exist, doesnt give a bugger about the gender or sexuality of any couple who are in love and wish to marry in accord with their beliefs..

Once in my country a simple declaration by two people before their God unwitnessed or witnessed being immaterial, was all that was required for a couple to be recognised as married by the world at large.. the Roman Catholic church when it replaced the old Celtic church soon put a stop to that.. maybe it is time to go back to those ancient days when we decide whether we are in a union and not church or state.. and for that union to be recognised for what it is.. a marriage of two people...

So I agree with Duckie.. good luck to them.. they will need it, but I sense they are not alone in the world and without support..

I can't think of a thing to add other than my wish for the couple to be as happy and healthy as they can.

[Dorian Earnest]

You must be mistaken -- the whole story must be a big mistake! I am now living in my third Muslim country and have been repeatedly assured that there are NO gay Muslims (and they don't even know what bi is).

LOL

(never mind that I know some or both types of both sexes living in all 3 countries personally)

So you need to recheck your facts -- three countries full of people can't be wrong -- can they?

It would be funny if it weren't such sad denial of reality.

[NotLostJustWandering]

I am not excusing fundamentalist dogma and the result of that, but it important for people to realize that the moderate viewpoint seldom sells news copy either. I recently participated in a Freedom to Marry Rally on Valentine's Day - in what you might normally think of as a relatively conservative area given what it says on paper about us. I was pleasantly surprised by the number of honks we got from passing traffic in support of the cause. It got me to thinking that maybe the moderate viewpoint just doesn't get a lot of air time lately.

Exactly. From my years in the NYC progressive religious community I can promise you that nothing a moderate Muslim says or does will get any news coverage, unless it is misinterpreted as an extremist act or statement. But the mikes are open for any American pundit who feels like bemoaning "why are all these alleged moderate Muslims so silent?"

[NotLostJustWandering]

Once in my country a simple declaration by two people before their God unwitnessed or witnessed being immaterial, was all that was required for a couple to be recognised as married by the world at large.. the Roman Catholic church when it replaced the old Celtic church soon put a stop to that..

You sure about that, Fran? I was under the impression that the transformation of marriage from a spiritual to a legal institution happened later, during the Industrial Age.


maybe it is time to go back to those ancient days when we decide whether we are in a union and not church or state..

That's what I'm always saying. Let the individuals define their families and let the government take note of what they tell them and not argue about it. All this gay marriage talk sounds like "equal prisons for all." Wouldn't it be simpler, more encompassing and less divisive to just put the state in its place?


and for that union to be recognised for what it is.. a marriage of two people...

... or more. Right?

[darkeyes]

You sure about that, Fran? I was under the impression that the transformation of marriage from a spiritual to a legal institution happened later, during the Industrial Age.





Its what our history tells us NotLost hun.. am not talkin 'bout legalised marriage in the sense we understand it today.. 2 all intents and purposes until the reformation Roman Catholic Church law was the law governing marriage and after that the respective protestant churches.. in the case of my country.. the presbyterian Kirk (Church of Scotland).. in the early part of the 19th century things changed as the state began to take a more active role in legalised marriage and since then cetralised records of Births, Deaths and Marriages have been kept and required that in the constituent countries of the UK, priests of all religions must be licensed as registrars before they can hold legally recognised wedding ceremonies.

The introduction of civil ceremonies in Registry Offices finally filled a need for those either through conviction or circumstance (ie divorce) unable to have a religious ceremony. Under Scots Common law in fact couples who had been together for 7 years were recognised as married for legal purposes something which as far as I know holds good to this day (In respect of heterosexual couples at least.. it has't been legally tested in respect of same sex couples and civil unions.. but I suppose in theory.. if Scotland, as it claims to be, is truly in support of proper equality for all, at the very least it should be). This common law concept of marriage was not the case in other British countries.

So you arent actually wrong Not hun.. but what you say isnt the whole story..:)